[zeromq-dev] CZMQ community & red cards

Luna Duclos luna.duclos at palmstonegames.com
Fri Oct 17 14:25:14 CEST 2014


Hello,

I don't usually talk on the mailing list very often, but here goes, I'll
keep this short and sweet.
I think a full ban was unwarranted, from what I can tell, this is the first
time @mrvn has acted in this way, he's been doing his best to be as
constructive as he can on all earlier PRs you linked.
A formal warning definitely is however.

Luna,

On Fri, Oct 17, 2014 at 1:29 PM, <rf at q-leap.de> wrote:

> >>>>> "Pieter" == Pieter Hintjens <ph at imatix.com> writes:
>
> Hi Pieter,
>
> apart from a mini contribution (CVE assignment) my role in this project
> is only that of a user, but I don't think that should matter too much for
> the purpose of this discussion.
>
> In my opinion Goswin (who is working on ZMQ for a project here at
> Q-Leap) has been bashed enough now and I certainly don't want to negate
> the justification for the blame concerning some of his comments. But
> this discussion was extremely one-sided. I believe your behavior in this
> dissent had a lot of room for improvement as well.
>
>     Pieter> Sorry... this is the last thread:
>     Pieter> https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/733
>
>     Pieter> Related older threads from CZMQ:
>
>     Pieter> - https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/725
>
> Can't see any reason for a red card here.
>
>     Pieter> - https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/673
>
> Neither here.
>
> Let's cite some facts:
> ======================================================================
> Citation Pieter (https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/733):
> "Making mistakes and doing broken things is part of our work. We deal
> with that politely, and nicely."
>
> Citation Pieter (https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/673):
> "What are we supposed to do with that? I don't even want to read the
> code, it looks like vomit. ... Can you please remove all the crap"
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Judge yourself. Your two statements sound like a contradiction to
> me. And it wasn't that Goswin started with this tone in 673. Would you
> have tolerated this from Goswin? If not, why do you tolerate it from
> yourself? Bringing in such a tone begs for aggressive answers ...
>
> ======================================================================
>
> Citation Pieter
> (http://lists.zeromq.org/pipermail/zeromq-dev/2014-October/027559.html )
> "You have not accepted any criticism at all. You show no regret, or
> apology."
>
> After a heated discussion in https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/698,
> Goswin clearly shows his intent to play with the rules (last two
> comments).
>
> ======================================================================
>
> Citation Brian
> (http://lists.zeromq.org/pipermail/zeromq-dev/2014-October/027554.html)
> "We do not merge everything and then fix it if it is broken. Your statement
> is empirically false."
>
> Citation Pieter (https://github.com/zeromq/czmq/pull/673):
> "I treat a pull request as a request to merge. I blindly merge everything,
> and fix up afterwards (or complain if that feels too painful) :-)"
>
> Hmm, which one is right now???
>
> ======================================================================
>
> Final comments:
> ---------------
>
> Important rules for anyone to claim leadership: Obey the rules you set
> yourself. And be open for criticism (yes, it sometimes hurts).
>
> I think this episode and the whole discussion was not something, that this
> project can be proud of. You can just continue like you did, or start
> thinking about the mistakes, you made just like others should think about
> theirs to avoid them in the future. In my opinion, the latter would be
> highly
> beneficial for the actors credibility, authority and respect ... and the
> project ...
>
> It was my idea to contribute the stuff we're doing in the project at
> Q-Leap back to the community. But this obviously didn't work out. So be
> it. To be honest, now I don't really care anymore. For others being
> interested in the code we develop: We'll probably keep our repo
> available and updated at GitHub. Please note, this is not supposed to be
> a fork or anything abusive :) Take the code (if so with a copyright
> assignment) or leave it.
>
> If you still want me to do the CVE assignment for the project, that's
> fine. I'll continue doing it. Otherwise let me know.
>
> Best,
>
> Roland
>
> -------
> http://www.q-leap.com / http://qlustar.com
>           --- HPC / Storage / Cloud Linux Cluster OS ---
>
>     Pieter> Also at least one long and confused thread on this group.
>
>     Pieter> -Pieter
>
>     Pieter> On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 2:15 PM, <rf at q-leap.de> wrote:
>     >>>>>>> "PH" == Pieter Hintjens <ph at imatix.com> writes:
>     >>
>     >> Hi Pieter,
>     >>
>     PH> I'd like to get feedback on a thread[1] regarding what I
>     PH> consider to be unacceptable behavior from a CZMQ contributor.
>     >>
>     >> you forgot to add the reference ([1]) to this thread. Could you
>     >> please send it as well?
>     >>
>     >> Thanks,
>     >>
>     >> Roland
>     >>
>     >> ------- http://www.q-leap.com / http://qlustar.com
>     >> --- HPC / Storage / Cloud Linux Cluster OS ---
>     >>
>     >> _______________________________________________ zeromq-dev
>     >> mailing list zeromq-dev at lists.zeromq.org
>     >> http://lists.zeromq.org/mailman/listinfo/zeromq-dev
> _______________________________________________
> zeromq-dev mailing list
> zeromq-dev at lists.zeromq.org
> http://lists.zeromq.org/mailman/listinfo/zeromq-dev
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://lists.zeromq.org/pipermail/zeromq-dev/attachments/20141017/05e1c425/attachment.htm>


More information about the zeromq-dev mailing list